“As an officer in the military, you are given boundaries that you need to work within, but there is a lot of freedom within those boundaries. You are able to use creativity to come up with the best way to accomplish a mission. ”
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Why Listen
I could have spent a full episode talking about the six incredible positions held by today’s guest since his time in the Army - his work as an Associate Principal at McKinsey & Company, as Managing Director at KKR, as Senior Vice President at HP, as CEO at Micro Focus, and as an Advisory Partner at Andreessen Horowitz. Each of those blow my mind! While we touch on this briefly, we spend the bulk of our time discussing Chris’ his current role as CEO and Co-Founder of Zibo, which blends real estate, financial services, and software. I view this interview more as a personal mentorship call, where I soaked up as much of Chris 20+ years of experience as possible. Whether you are interested in entrepreneurship, developing a side hustle into a full-time job, consulting, finance, or tech, this interview will have a wealth of knowledge for you.
About Chris Hsu
Chris Hsu is the CEO & Co-Founder of Zibo, a company he started nearly 2 years ago to radically improve financial services for independent landlords. Chris has raised over $10M in venture capital and the company employee over 20 people. His path to this point started at West Point, included over 5 years in the Army, work at General Mills, McKinsey & Company, KKR, HP, and Andreessen Horowitz. He holds an MBA from the Kellogg School of Management.
Selected Resources:
Good to Great
Built to Last
The Art of Management
Endurance
7 Habits of Highly effective people
The importance of prioritization (urges vs. important)
How to Win Friends and Influence people
Transcript & Time Stamps:
5:09
What was your transition out of the Army like?
I loved being in the Army. My intent was to stay in and be a career officer. I was stationed at Fort Lewis with an assignment with the Armor Battalion. When I arrived at Fort Lewis, my orders got changed. I was placed in an XO position for the Support Battalion. In that role, I was distant from command, which was what I really wanted to do. Since I was no longer able to accomplish that goal of becoming a CO, I made the decision to get out.
7:55
What was your first job search like?
I had no clue. I was scared about getting out. I didn’t know anything but the Army. I called some friends that had gotten out ahead of me to learn from them. I was considering business school but decided that wouldn’t be the best move for me. I went to a job conference where I was exposed to many different industries.
9:55
You eventually did get your MBA. What lead you back to that?
I ended up at General Mills as a brand manager after getting out of the Army. But after a couple years, I wasn’t sure that I wanted to stay in that industry. I was 1 of 5 people in the company in that role that didn’t have an MBA. I saw that getting an MBA would allow me to explore different industries while also allowing me to propel my career forward.
I went to a one-year accelerated program at Kellogg. In hindsight, the MBA was an investment in myself. I got a year to think and reflect about what I wanted from my career.
An MBA is an investment. Make sure you are sucking up every ounce of knowledge that you can if you decide to go down that road.
14:30
I admire that by the time you went to business school, you already had business experience rather than going to business school straight after the military. I’m sure you were able to soak up so much knowledge that way.
There’s no structure for the right career path. One of the biggest issues I see with people when they get out of the military is that people struggle with a lack of clarity. The military is so structured and that’s not necessarily the case outside the military. The choices of what you want to do with your career are nearly infinite.
For me, I gave up the idea of having a long-term plan. What I realized was that I would create a long-term plan but then a couple years in, that would change. You don’t want to be so focused on a plan, that you’re missing an opportunity that will stretch you beyond your comfort zone.
20:10
How can veterans be more comfortable taking risks?
I was not a rule follower as a kid. I was a troublemaker. I ended up going to West Point because our school disciplinarian got me interested in leadership and steered me to West Point. There’s a stereotype that if you’re in the military, you’re a rule follower. But that wasn’t the case for me.
As a second lieutenant, I had guys working for me in each of those missions. I was given boundaries to work within but I had to be creative about how exactly to get the job done. The nature of what you do in the military is risky but you know what your boundaries are. And within those boundaries, you need to have creativity to come up with how to best accomplish that mission.
23:30
You’re the CEO of Zibo. Can you describe the company?
When I got out of the military, I realized I was poor. So I was motivated to learn about investing. I started studying real estate and rental properties. I’ve lived through every pain point that you can possibly have in real estate. I built Zibo to help independent landlords address the needs they have as a property owner. We assist with banking, payments, and insurance.
When I was working at Andreesen Horowitz, I worked with venture capitalists and entrepreneurs. During that time, I was also working on the side as an independent landlord. The people I worked with at Andreesen Horowitz were incredibly comfortable taking investment risk. I was inspired to start my own company from that willingness to take risk.
In February 2019, I started having a real conviction around this opportunity in the real estate space and how technology could help me create a tool that would assist landlords. I started the company in April. It was a scary process at first. It took me awhile to recruit the first few employees. But by then, the company was starting to pick up momentum.
33:00
What advice would you give to a veteran that wants to start their own company?
I would never discourage someone from starting a company straight out of the military. But after the military, I had the opportunity to work with world class organizations around the world. That was a huge learning experience for me. I also had a family to think about and thought that starting a business right after the military was too risky.
We’re starting to get traction now with Zibo but starting a company is extremely difficult. All of the decisions and processes are up to you. For me it was extremely beneficial to get corporate experience first before starting my own company.
As a business owner it’s important to have the humility of understanding what you don’t know and surrounding yourself with people that have those talents and are able to help the company move forward.
39:00
When you started Zibo, how long was it until you raised your first round of funding?
We raised money pretty much right away. Then eight months later, we raised again. Altogether it amounted to about $10 million.
I think a lot of people hesitate to raise capital because they don’t want to give up equity. But it’s a little bit of a chicken and egg situation because you can’t build a scalable company without invested capital. So it’s a tradeoff but for me, it felt necessary.
44:00
How do your experience in entrepreneurship compare to your time at more established firms like McKinsey, HP, and Andreesen Horowitz?
In previous roles, I was traveling all the time. It’s exhausting and I wasn’t at home with my family as much as I wanted. The difference with entrepreneurship is that I have independence but the weight of the organization is on your shoulders. I feel that weight and I feel responsibility for each of our employees.
47:22
Are there any resources you would recommend to listeners?
I’m not as into podcasts as folks of younger generations. I learn from my millennial employees because they’re consuming great content and then using it to grow our company.
I have read a lot of management books and leadership memoirs. Good to Great and Built to Last to two I would recommend. The Art of Management, Endurance, and the 7 Habits of Highly Effective People are also great.
52:30
Is there anything else you’d like to share?
If you’re thinking about getting out, there’s no substitute for taking things one step at a time. I’ve had plenty of failures in my career. I would think back on my time at Ranger School when I thought I couldn’t go any further. But somehow, you continue. To me, that’s what it takes to be successful in any career. It’s endurance and willingness to find the strength to keep going.