“You never took the time to even figure out what you wanted to do. You stuck in line with your current career path into a job you didn’t really want, because you didn’t know anywhere else to go, into a company you knew nothing about. You got there and went, “this sucks” - and you left.”
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Why Listen:
The top two reasons to listen to this interview are:
1.Straight talk - Josh is very direct about the struggles he has faced in his career and transition. The wisdom he shares is incisive, and I think a lot of Veterans will appreciate both the sincerity and authenticity of his advice.
2.Consulting & project management - we talk about Josh’s experience with both consulting and project management, and why Veterans may love either of these career paths.
Beyond the Uniform has over 350 podcast episodes and 20 videos with America’s top Veterans, including Jocko Willink, the former CEO of Pepsi, NFL players and more. They are all for free at BeyondTheUniform.org. If you benefit from Beyond the Uniform and would like to help get this in front of more members of the military community, please consider donating at BeyondTheUniform.org/donate. You can also text SUPPORTBTU to 33777 and we will send you additional information. Our cost of production is $300 per month, we are an all-volunteer team, and we could use your financial support. That is at BeyondTheUniform.org/donate or by texting SUPPORTBTU to 33777.
About Josh:
Josh is a Consultant at Whitney, Bradley & Brown (WBB), as well as a Training Consultant at PM-ProLearn. He started out at the Naval Academy, after which he served in the Marine Corps for over 11 years.
Our Sponsor:
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Partners:
Have you ever wondered how you could become a more effective and balanced leader? Or how to find a team with a high degree of trust that performs at a level you’re accustomed to? Check out The Leadership Podcast where they study what makes the best leaders tick - including many who have moved "beyond the uniform" to reach new levels of success and fulfillment.
Selected Resources:
Transcript & Time Stamps:
2:35
Joining me from Bristow, VA is Josh Atkinson. What would you like listeners to know about you that’s not in your bio?
I”m a passionate beef smoker. I got a smoker for my birthday a few years ago and I really love it.
4:38
Can you talk to us about your transition out of the Marine Corps?
I failed as a Marine. I planned on staying in for 20 years. But I struggled with the “bro” mentality in the aviation community. I had the mentality that everyone should be accepted as part of the team. But what I found was that there was a lot of politics.
I ended up making the transition from aviation to infantry. I got deployed and missed the birth of my daughter which was disappointing. The first CO I worked under during deployment was amazing. But the second CO was very egotistical and tough to work for. Ultimately, when I was coming up for Major, I got passed over. Emotionally it was really hard because I knew I needed to start preparing to get out.
I worked with a headhunter as I was transitioning out called Lance Careers. The best thing they did was send me through training to help figure out what might be a good career for you. I figured out that project management could be a good fit for me. I had gotten a certification during my time in the Marine Corps.
The head hunter set up a weekend where I had ten interviews over the course of two days. There was one that was interested in me that I was also interested in. It was a heavy construction management role. It was a great field but I didn’t feel that I really had the freedom to be creative in that position.
Ultimately, I felt that the job was a great fit for me. But I felt like I couldn’t leave. In the military, you’re always trying to make your team as good as possible and you don’t have the option to leave. So I was trying to apply those same principles to my job in construction. I saw so many things I wanted to improve. But the truth was, that it wasn’t a good fit and I didn’t owe them the rest of my career. I realized that I had autonomy over creating the right career path for myself.
In the military, there is structure. Your career is mapped out for you. When you get out, it’s hard to not have that foundation. But you also have more freedom to create a career and life that works for you.
22:10
Can you describe the foreign orphan metaphor to us?
You are born at bootcamp. You’re told how to think and act. After bootcamp, you’re in kindergarten. You have a few more freedoms and learn new things. During your time in the military, you keep growing inside this family. Everything is provided for you - pay, healthcare, and housing. When you leave, your last name is “Veteran”.
In the civilian sector, it’s not like that. As a veteran, you often feel like you don’t fit in. The corporate world also won’t guarantee you work the way you were accustomed to in the military. But you have to realize that you don’t have to guarantee yourself to a company either. If something isn’t a good fit for you, you can leave.
After I left active duty, I ended up joining the Reserves. That allowed me to get together with people who understood my military background. When I first got out, I often felt like an outsider. When I went to drill with the Reserves, it was like going back to my family. An income from the Reserves can give you some time to explore different civilian career options without so much financial pressure.
29:15
How has networking helped you in your career?
In the military networking isn’t as quite as important so I got out not really knowing how to network. Once I was hired at PM-Pro Learn, I started networking on LinkedIn trying to find veterans that might be a good fit for project management.
The way I found my current position was through networking. I reached out to someone I had served with in the Marines and we just started talking. He introduced me to some other people at his company and eventually a position opened up for me.
I advise veterans that are getting out to start reaching out to people on LinkedIn. Find a veteran at a company you’re interested in and send them a message. People want to help you out.
I think a lot of veterans end up at jobs they don’t like after the military is because they’re not networking. They just accept the first job offer they get and then realize six months later, ‘this sucks’.
36:00
What would you like to share about project management?
Project Management is the closest thing I’ve found to being a leader in the military. It’s a great field. You can work toward the PMP certification while you’re still in the military. That will help you in your job and will also help you find work after you transition out. I got my PMP certification four months before I got out and wished that I had gotten it sooner.
38:30
Can you talk about PMP certifications?
I think certifications help communicate and translate your capabilities. When you get a PMP certification, you are indicating to people that you can speak the language of project management. In my first job out of the Marines, having my PMP certification gave me instant credibility.
44:20
Are there any resources you would recommend?
Two great books are Strengths Finder by Tom Rath and Start With Why and Simon Sinek.
45:00
What is ‘Crazy Ideas Guy’?
I’m not great at inventing things. But I like taking whatever is around me and optimizing it and making it better. That’s why I encourage people to throw out crazy ideas so that you and others around you can help you improve that idea.
50:10
Is there anything else you’d like to share with listeners?
Life is hard. But through perseverance, you become better at who you are. You’ll come out at the end as a better and more capable person.
Your transition won’t be easy. But just don’t quit. At the end, you’ll be better for it.